Life From Plato's Cave

Trailer

Trailer for Life From Plato's Cave. 

lifefromplatoscave.com

Follow me on Twitter for updates: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave

Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 1 - Welcome to Plato‘s Cave

lifefromplatoscave.com 

Welcome to Life From Plato's Cave. This is a course in interdisciplinary philosophy in which we look at life - the part of life that interests you - from a new perspective in every episode. In each of the following episodes, I will interview a guest about their intepretation of Plato's Allegory of the Cave: philosophers, artists, literary scholars, phycisists, actors, psychologists, geologists and many more.

In this first episode, I introduce the podcast and Masha will read the allegory to you. If you want to skip to the allegory, go to 5:30.

What's YOUR interpretation of Plato's allegory? I would love to hear! Leave me a voicemail. It's really easy. You click the record button, speak, and hit send. I might play your message in a future episode and respond.

Masha Bronnikova, aka Mab'by writes, performs and instigates cultural events: https://www.facebook.com/SoundMatterPlatform/ 

The logo for this podcast was created by Julien of Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Follow me on Twitter for updates: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave

Or on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 

Mario Veen

Episode 2 - Philosophy & Truth with Johannes Niederhauser

Ask not what you can do with philosophy, but what philosophy can do with you! In this episode, I discuss life from Plato's Cave from a philosophical perspective with Johannes Niederhauser. We discuss, among other things, Heidegger's Essay Plato's Doctrine of Truth.

A superficial reading of Plato's Cave might suggest that there are two worlds, and that the truth is something out there to be found like an island out in the ocean (or like a sun-drenched paradise outside the cave). But is that really the case? Heidegger puts forward a radically different interpretation than the two-world theory of Plato's Cave. Truth is not about whether something is correct, but rather about the degree to which it un-hides or reveals what is hidden. Truth happens because we participate in it, and this is not a one-time event but a path we travel over and over again. Also, we better not rush but take the time at each stage to let it reveal itself to us.

What's YOUR interpretation of Plato's allegory? I would love to hear! Leave me a voicemail. It's really easy. You click the record button, speak, and hit send. I might play your message in a future episode and respond.

Support me through patreon: https://www.patreon.com/lifefromplatoscave 

Enjoy!

Mario

About Johannes Niederhauser

Johannes is the founder of the Halkyon Thinkers' Guild (https://www.halkyonguild.org/), created the youtube channel Classical Philosophy (https://www.youtube.com/c/ClassicalPhilosophy). Johannes' book "Heidegger on Death and Being" is available here: https://link.springer.com/book/10.1007/978-3-030-51375-7.

Twitter: https://twitter.com/JohannesAchill

Insta: https://www.instagram.com/classical.philosophy/

Here are references to some of the sources that came up in our conversation:

- Heidegger (1953), The Fundamental Question of Metaphysics (https://stjuphilosophyreadinggroup.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/fundamental-question-of-metaphysics-the.pdf)

- Johannes reading Plato's Cave: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn0OaSWLYpk

- E.M. Foster (1909),The Machine Stops (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Machine_Stops). Johannes reads and discusses it in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uioIJK0INc 

- Heidegger wrote a short essay on Plato's Cave called "Plato's Doctrine of Truth" which is recommended if you have never read anything by him (http://artsingames.free.fr/Heidegger,%20Martin%20-%20Plato's%20Doctrine%20of%20Truth.pdf). The longer version of this is the book The Essence of Truth (https://www.amazon.com/Essence-Truth-Theaetetus-Bloomsbury-Revelations/dp/147252571X)

- The other philosophers Johannes mentions are Georg Hegel, Immanuel Kant and Jean Beaudrillard

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

Website: http://www.lifefromplatoscave.com

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 

Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 

Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 3 - Art, Urgency & Inter-ship with Mieke Bal

In Plato's Cave, the prisoners start out being limited to only one perspective, one way to look at life. But they turn around and go on a journey, where they encounter images that challenge what they have always believed about who they are and how the world works. In this episode, we will look at the way we can look at the world from different angles. We discuss how art can not only help us do that, but is in fact necessary and urgent. How can image-thinking bring new ideas into society? Is it necessary to have a clear identity? What is the role between madness and invention? I spoke about these and other questions with Mieke Bal.

 

About Mieke Bal

Mieke (www.miekebal.org) started as a literary scholar. Her commitment is to interdisciplinary approaches to cultural artifacts and their potential effects. She focuses on gender, migratory culture, psychoanalysis, and the critique of capitalism. Mieke published over fourty books, curated many exhibitions. She directed films and documentaries, many of which are exhibited as video installations in museums over the world. Her books include a trilogy on political art. The titles of these books are Endless Andness, Thinking in Film, and Of What One Cannot Speak. They demonstrate her integrated approach to academic, artistic and curatorial work. This year she has new books coming out, including a book called Image-Thinking, a term she coined and which we will discuss later on. Mieke has had a long academic career and supervised 80 PhDs, with the 81st currently underway.

Mieke did not just limit herself to teaching, research and theoretical development. She (co-)made documentaries on migratory culture, and films which she calls ‘theoretical fictions.’ A Long History of Madness argues for a more humane treatment of psychosis, and was exhibited in a site-specific version, Saying It, in the Freud Museum in London. Madame B was combined with paintings by Edvard Munch in the Munch Museum in Oslo. Reasonable Doubt is about the philosopher René Descartes and explores the social aspects of thinking. The installation Don Quixote: tristes figuras is exhibited as a sixteen channel video work. Becoming Vera is a documentary about a girl who is "three years old. Living in three worlds". Her latest film, It’s About Time! Reflections on Urgency was produced in Poland (2020), just before the corona pandemic. It's a short film and you can watch it in full on Mieke's website. Her exhibition Art out of Necessesity in the museum Jan Cunen in Oss unfortunately was cut short because of the corona pandemic, but there is a Dutch book about the exhibition and you can find some short video's about the exhibition here. 

 

In our discussion, I mention the portrait of Mieke by Carla van Puttelaar that was positioned at the beginning of the exhibition. You can find the image here: https://www.instagram.com/p/B8E2bEjlLml/ 

 

We also speak about Dali's The Invisible Man: https://www.dalipaintings.com/the-invisible-man.jsp 

 

I hope you enjoy our discussion!

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 

Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 

Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 4 - Life as Film with Masha Bronnikova

Plato's description of the Cave is kind of like a cinema: an audience watching shadows on a screen, projected by a fire behind them. Have you ever felt like your life is a film? Have you noticed how many films have incorporated a Plato's Cave theme - The Matrix, Inception and The Truman Show, just to name a few? How can we learn from film, especially in this time when we are watching so many series and films?

Our guide for this cinematic journey through the Cave is Masha Bronnikova.

 

About Masha Bronnikova (aka Mab'by)

Masha initiates and joins inter-disciplinary projects around The Netherlands. She is a poet and performer, she is a cultural producer and a connector. Masha works with platforms such as OT301 Studios, DNK-Amsterdam, Stingerbol and The Bookstore Foundation. 

Check out Masha's Soundcloud for her poetry, readings, and other sounds: https://soundcloud.com/user-949529117

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/SoundMatterPlatform

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mashabronn22/

 

To avoid any spoilers, please watch all of these films prior to listening to the episode:

Stalker (1979), Be Natural: The Untold Story of Alice Guy-Blaché (2018), Arrival of a Train at La Ciotat (1895), The Fairy of the Cabbages (1896), Cave of Forgotten Dreams (2010), Nostalghia (1983), The Sacrifice (1986), Once Upon A Time in Hollywood (2019), The Violent Heart (2020), Waking Life (2001), WandaVision (2021), Star Wars (1977), Frozen (2013), Soul (2020), The Matrix (1999), Blade Runner (1982), Interstellar (2014), I, Robot (2004), Dark City (1998), The Maze Runner (2014), The Hunger Games (2012), Inception (2010), The Truman Show (1998), To All The Boys: Always and Forever (2021), Transformers: The Last Knight (2017), The Bone Collector (1999), Escape From New York (1981), Escape from Alcatraz (1979), Slumdog Millionaire (2008),  The Irony of Faith (1976), 2001: A Space Odyssey (1968), A Clockwork Orange (1971),  Independence Day (1996),  The Birds (1963), King Kong (2005), The Avengers (2012), and last but not least, Orlando (1992).

 

These are some of the scenes we mention:

Arrival of a Train at La Ciotat (The Lumière Brothers, 1986): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RYNThid23g

Candle Scene from André Tarkovski's Nostalghia: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3Dp6EdFRHo

Holy Moment scene in Waking Life: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmL9rt3Onj4

 

Welcome To The Desert of the Real, Zizek: https://anarcosurrealisti.noblogs.org/files/2010/10/Welcome-to-the-desert-of-the-real.pdf

Exhibition about Orlando: https://www.plaatsmaken.nl/nl/tentoonstelling/the-weight-of-spring 

 

I hope you enjoy our discussion!

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:
Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 
Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 5 - Geology & Timefulness with Marcia Bjornerud

Sometimes a cave is just a cave. Geologist Marcia Bjornerud will give us a guided tour of Plato's Cave.

Marcia Bjornerud is Professor of Geology and Environmental Studies at Lawrence University in Appleton. Her research focuses on the physics of earthquakes and mountain-building, and she combines field-based studies of bedrock geology with quantitative models of rock mechanics. Marcia was named Outstanding Educator in 2011 by the Association of Women Geoscientists. She is the author of  Reading the Rocks:  The Autobiography of the Earth, a contributing writer to The New Yorker’s science and technology blog, “Elements”. Her most recent book is called Timefulness: How thinking like a geologist can help save the world. In 2022, she will publish Geopedia: A Cabinet of Geologic Curiosities. In Reading the Rocks, Marcia writes that "The only autobiography that was transcribed without any self-interest or self-consciousness is the life history of Earth, which has literally been written in the rocks. [It is] the only text that should be mandatory for every earthling. Because we are destroying the roof and destabilizing the heating system of our beautiful home - our only shelter - without having taken the trouble to study the construction details of this house."

 

 

Sources we mention in the podcast:

-John Harte (2002), Toward a Synthesis of the Newtonian and Darwinian Worldviews. https://physicstoday.scitation.org/doi/10.1063/1.1522164 

-Sabine Hossenfelder (2018), Lost in Math: How Beauty Leads Physics Astray (more on this book in a later episode) 

- Livestream of the Icelandic volcano eruption (updated 11-Apr-21): https://www.ruv.is/frett/2021/03/18/bein-utsending-fra-gosstodvunum-nyjar-sprungur-opnast 

 

Videos that capture thinking on geologic timescales, provided by Marcia: 

Nice illustration of how scale modeling with sand can allow us to see mountain-building processes too slow to experience directly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9bKXY0OMxc

 

This one is not about rock deformation over time, but shows how geologists take 2D surface (map) information and convert it into 3D: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CHd6_cIT44

 

A recently released depiction of plate motions over the past 800 million years: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/06/science/tectonic-plates-continental-drift.html

 

A more detailed plate tectonics animation centered on the Mediterranean region over the past 200 millions years (it first goes backward in time, then forward again to the present): https://www.facebook.com/GeologyWay/videos/2576386299268336/

 

But Marcia's absolute favorite is this non-scientific animation:  "Das Rad/The Rocks": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOPwXNFU7oU

 

I hope you enjoy our discussion!

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 
Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 6 - Trauma & the Holocaust with Ernst van Alphen

When the prisoner in Plato's cave is released and turns around, the light of the fire is painful and terrifying. Running back to their seat, it makes no sense at all and they have no language to even speak about it. When we experience something that does not fit in the framework within which we make sense of our reality, can we even call it "experience"?

Ernst van Alphen calls trauma "failed experience". In this episode, we discuss the Holocaust in relation to trauma, experience, memory, archives and affect. We focus particularly on his essay Testimonies and the Limits of Representation, a chapter in his book Caught By History: Holocaust Effects In Contemporary Art, Literature, and Theory (Stanford U.P 1997). Ernst was so kind to make an older version of this chapter (Symptoms of Discursivity) available here. 

 

About Ernst van Alphen: 

Ernst van Alphen is professor of Literary Studies at Universiteit Leiden. His publications include Shame! And Masculinity (ed., Valiz 2020), Failed Images:Photography and Its Counter-Practices (Valiz 2018),  Staging the Archive: Art and Photography in the Age of New Media (Reaktion Books 2014), Art in Mind: How Contemporary Images Shape Thought (University of Chicago Press 2005), Armando: Shaping Memory (NAi Publishers 2000), Francis Bacon and The Loss of Self (Harvard U.P 1995).

 

Let's support people who experienced trauma.

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 
Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 7 - Astrophysics & Exolife with Vincent Icke

When we look at the situation of the prisoners in Plato's cave, their world is only one tiny part of all there is. They think that all that exists is the shadows on the wall. They're unaware of the fire, the way upwards, and everything at the surface. Have you ever looked at the stars at night and wondered what else is out there? 

 

Our guide today, astrophycisist Vincent Icke, writes: “There is nothing special about our Sun and the planets. [...] The matter that we consist of is the most common stuff in the Universe. All those planets, stars and galaxies were created from the same kinds of matter that we find in ourselves and around us. [...] The energy required for life is radiated by every star. The deep time required for biological evolution unfolds in every place." (translated from Reisbureau Einstein, 2017)

 

About Vincent Icke:

Vincent Icke is Professor of theoretical Astrophysics at Leiden University, where he founded the Astronomy Theory Group, and Professor of Cosmology at the University of Amsterdam in The Netherlands. His main research interests are cosmology, the relationship between dark matter and dark energy, the formation of structure in the Universe, and radiative hydrodynamics. Vincent takes an active interest in the popularization of science, participating in hundreds of productions on radio, fielm and television. He wrote many books in Dutch and English. In this episode, we mainly discuss his two most recent books: Gravity Does Not Exist: A Puzzle For the 21st Century, about the relationship between relativity and quantum theory, and Reisbureau Einstein (Einstein’s Travel Agency) about the quest for extraterrestrial life. Vincent is also a visual artist, whose work covers a wide range of styles, media, applications and concepts. For instance, imagining what an alien spaceship might look like.

 

Sources

Vincent's artwork that we discuss at the beginning of the episode can be found here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CQQ81NmAFcj/

Vincent's website (in Dutch): https://home.strw.leidenuniv.nl/~icke/ 

Quantum Moves 2 (a game where you move quantum particles): https://www.scienceathome.org/games/quantum-moves-2/ 

 

I hope you enjoy the episode!

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 
Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 8 - Neuroscience, Meditation & Dance with Marieke van Vugt

The prisoners in Plato's Cave live in a world of projections. They think they see a cat, but it is actually a shadow of a statue of a cat. Is it the same for us? Do we live in a kind of illusion? And if so, what are ways to see through this illusion and lift the fog at least a little?

We explore these questions with neuroscientist, Buddhist and ballet dancer Marieke van Vugt. 

 

About Marieke: 

Marieke is an assistant professor in the cognitive modeling group at the University of Groningen (The Netherlands). She obtained her PhD with Michael Kahana in the neuroscience program of the University of Pennsylvania, after having spent one year at Brandeis University. After that I did a postdoc with Jonathan Cohen at Princeton University. The main question that guides her research is: how do we think? In what ways do we mind-wander? What effects does that have on decisions? And how can we make our thinking more adaptive by means of contemplative practices such as mindfulness and meditation. She likes to use mathematical models and techniques to better understand those very complicated data. This model-based neuroscience approach allows us to think about the mechanism by which someone thinks, and make more detailed predictions than verbal models.

 

Resources

Marieke's website, twitter and ballet-related pictures on her instagram. 

Mind and Life Institute: https://www.mindandlife-europe.org 

Evan Thompson: research on whether meditation makes you a better scientist https://evanthompson.me/

Jostein Gaarder (1991). Sophie's World: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophie%27s_World

Tamboukou M. Archival research: unravelling space/time/matter entanglements and fragments. Qualitative Research. 2014;14(5):617-633. doi:10.1177/1468794113490719

Jostein Gaarder, 1991. Sophie's World

Film about neurobiologist Francisco Varela: Monte Grande: What is Life? https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0466070/

Balerinas by Night :http://ballerinasbynight.blogspot.com/

Navillera (Netflix series, 2021)

Marieke van Vugt MK (2014) Ballet as a movement-based contemplative practice? Implications for neuroscientific studies. Front. Hum. Neurosci. 8:513. doi: 10.3389/fnhum.2014.00513

Dominic Pettman (2016) Infinite Distraction. Polity Books https://dominicpettman.com/books/infinite-distraction/

Ricard, Matthieu (1999). The Monk and the Philosopher. New York City: Schocken. https://www.amazon.com/Monk-Philosopher-Father-Discuss-Meaning/dp/0805211039 

The Brain Facts Book (free download in many languages) https://www.brainfacts.org/the-brain-facts-book

Social Psychology experiment on change blindness: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBPG_OBgTWg and https://youtu.be/VkrrVozZR2c?t=101

 

I hope you enjoy the episode!

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 
Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/ 

Episode 9 - The Biggest Question in Physics with Vincent Icke

After the prisoner in Plato's cave has been released, and while they are climbing up to the surface, they no longer have the familiarity and comfort of their everyday life. But neither do they have the insight that comes with arriving at the surface. They are in between worlds, in between realities. They're in a state of profound confusion. And yet they must continue to climb upwards.

 

Today I speak with Vincent Icke for the second time. We discuss discovery in theoretical physics. How do you navigate when you don't have a map, when you don't have a frame of reference? Can mathematics guide us to answer the biggest question in physics of the 21st century? Or larger particle accelerators?

 

About Vincent Icke:

Vincent Icke is Professor of theoretical Astrophysics at Leiden University, where he founded the Astronomy Theory Group, and Professor of Cosmology at the University of Amsterdam in The Netherlands. His main research interests are cosmology, the relationship between dark matter and dark energy, the formation of structure in the Universe, and radiative hydrodynamics. Vincent takes an active interest in the popularization of science, participating in hundreds of productions on radio, fielm and television. He wrote many books in Dutch and English. For instance, Gravity Does Not Exist: A Puzzle For the 21st Century, about the relationship between relativity and quantum theory, and Reisbureau Einstein (Einstein’s Travel Agency) about the quest for extraterrestrial life. His latest book (Dutch) is called Licht: Tussen waarheid en wetenschap (Light: Between truth and science) and at the end of our conversation we refer to The Force of Symmetry.

Vincent is also a visual artist, whose work covers a wide range of styles, media, applications and concepts. For instance, imagining what an alien spaceship might look like.

 

I hope you enjoy the episode!

Mario

http://lifefromplatoscave.com/ 

 

Here's how to contact me if you have any questions or comments:

 

Twitter: https://twitter.com/lifeplatoscave 
Insta: https://www.instagram.com/lifefromplatoscave/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lifefromplatoscave 
Illustration © by Julien Penning, Light One Art: https://www.instagram.com/light_one_art/